tv Charlie Rose PBS October 2, 2012 12:00am-1:00am PDT
>> rose: we begin evening with anders fogh rasmussen, he's the secretary general of nato. this conversation was recorded on friday while he was attending the united nations general assembly. >> by the end of 2013 we will have-- 2014 we lch 352,000 afghan security forces and even more importantly quality wise they will be very capable. some time ago i visited afghanistan myself and i had an opportunity to observe with my own eyes afghan special operation forces in action and i was very impressed by what i saw. so the taliban miscalculate the situation if they think their situation will be better by the end of 2014. they will be faced with a very strong and capable afghan security force. >> rose: we continue by looking at a new project in brooklyn, it's a basketball arena and a development. it brought together interesting people, including mikhail
prokhorov and irina prok rovea his sister, bruce ratner the developer and karen brooks hop hopkins. >> i think the barkley center is in keeping with the spirit of brooklyn. >> wh n what way? >> it's like very energetic and you know in the history there were a lot of claims to change urban landscapes just ifill tow and we do remember that the eiffel tower, we can't imagine paris without it and i think it's just a matter of getting used to it. >> rose: nato and brooklyn when we continue.
captioning sponsored by rose communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. >> rose: anders fogh rasmussen is here, he is the secretary general of nato, he was the prime minister of denmark for eight years before assuming his current post in 2009. he is in new york for the u.n. general assembly, nato has significantly redefined its mission since its founding in 1949. it's primarily-- last year it enforce add no-fly zone in libya and the campaign that overthrew moammar qaddafi. i'm pleased to have the secretary general at this table, welcome. tell me how you have defined the role for nato in the current environment, especially in the middle east. >> the core role is still to protect our citizens against any
threat to their security we won the cold war. we protected our citizens against soviet communism, aggression. we won the cold war. the soviet broke down but after the end of the cold war we realized that we are faced we merging security challenges, terrorism, this is the reason why we are in afghanistan. that's why we are now building a nato missile defense system to protect our populations against milz attacks. piracy, this is the reasons why we conduct counterpiracy operation. so across the board we have taken on responsibility for new missions but, again, with the core task to protect our citizens against any threat. >> rose: how much of that is borne by the united states, both in terms of budget and in terms of resources? >> a lot, of course.
the united states is the biggest ally accounting for around 80% of the overall defense expenditure in our alliance. so it really is a huge contribution. but politically i think it's of jut most importance also for a superpower like the united states to have allies in europe, like-minded democracies. i find it of utmost importance that democracies in europe and north america stand together shoulder to shoulder to defend our common values. >> rose: when you talk about missile defense, against missiles coming from where? >> well, actually, our missile defense system is not directed against any specific country but it aims at protecting our populations against missile
threats from wherever. >> rose: incoming missiles from wherever they come from? >> exactly. and we know that more than 30 countries around the world have missile technologies rohr aspiring to get missle technologies, some of them with a range to hit population centers in europe. so we want to protect our population against that real threat. >> rose: an attack on any nato country an attack on all nato countries? >> exactly. that is stated that we consider an attack on one ally an attack on all. and on september 12, 2001, we invoked that famous article for the first time in the history of our alliance. we considered the terrorist attacks on the united states an attack on the whole alliance and actually that's the reason why we are in afghanistan today. >> rose: where do we stand now?
u.s. withdrawal is scheduled to end by 2014. what's the schedule for nato countries if it differs? >> it's the same. we have outlined a clear road map for a gradual handover of responsibility to the afghan security forces. that's a nato and i.s.a.f. decision. we have 50 countries in our i.s.a.f. coalition. 28 nato allies and 22 partners. and we have agreed on a road map according to which we will gradually hand over lead responsibility to the afghans. they will take full responsibility by the end of 2014 and our i.s.a.f. combat mission will end by the end of 2014. so that's a joined everyday and a joint plan. >> rose: could it be stalled by these killings on the part of people who would be part of afghan police but turn out to be
assassins? >> these so-called insider attacks will not derail our strategy. but i have to say they are a matter of great concern because people ask-- legitimately so-- why is it that we send trainers to help the afghans and they turn their weapons against the very same trainers. and these insider attacks threaten to undermine trusts and confidence between foreign troops and afghan security. >> rose: well there's a halt today, is there not? >> our commanders on the ground have introduced some temporary measures to prevent insider attacks. we have decided that in specific cases we will not conduct joint operations with afghan security forces. but these are prudent and temporary measures and i would expect them to be-- to these
joint operations to be resumed as soon as the situation allows and the timetable is still realistic despite these temporary measures. we expect normal relations to be resumed as soon as the situation allows and the fact is we continued partnered operations at the level of battalion and above. so basically we continue the strategy to train and educate afghan security forces. there's no train-- attempt at strategy. >> rose: when the french going out? >> well, some of them have left already. some of the combat troops. but i have to add the french stay committed. they continue to contribute in different ways. among other things they contribute trainers to our training mission in afghanistan. >> rose: but combat soldiers will be leaving by the end of
2013? >> actually by the end of this year. so they are in the process now of withdrawing but they still contribute trainers to our training mission in afghanistan so they stay committed until the end of 2014. >> rose: it's a presence but not a combat presence then. >> the same goes for the coalition partners. we have different tasks within and some people contribute trainers, others contribute combat troops. >> rose: okay. at the beginning of 2014 how many nations will do you think will be contributing combat troops? >> we don't know yet because that will very much depend on the security situation on the ground. >> rose: so it may not leave before 2014 if the situation gets worse? >> exactly. we will make decisions based on conditions on the ground. but it's clear... >> rose: at 2014? >> it's clear according to our road map that by the end of 2014 we will end our combat mission.
>> rose: what could change that? >> i don't see anything that could change that because we are on track. already now 75% of the afghan population live in areas where the afghan security forces have taken lead responsibility. that process continues that process continues and we have seen a decline in violence where in the areas where the afghans have taken responsibility. it's also a fact that 80% of the enemy-initiated attacks in afghanistan take place in areas where only 20% of the afghans live. in other words, a huge majority of afghans live in areas where a situation is relatively calm and stable. so i'm confident that we can fulfill the goal to end our combat mission by the end of 2014. >> rose: why should the taliban negotiate now if they believe
they'll be in a stronger position when the nato countries leave at the end of 2014? >> yeah, but they will not be in a stronger position. that's a very important point in our strategy that when we stop our combat mission a very capable afghan security force will take over. we are building up the number of afghan security forces. by the end of 2014 we will have 352,000 afghan security forces and even more importantly quality wise they will be very capable. some time ago i visited afghanistan myself and i had an opportunity to observe with my own eyes afghan special operation forces in action. and i was very impressed by what i saw. so the taliban miscalculated the situation if they think their situation will be better by the
end of 2014. they will be faced with a very strong and capable afghan security force. >> rose: so you are here to say that the training of the afghans is on schedule and you believe they will be able to handle the job when nato leaves? >> yes, indeed. >> rose: how about governance? >> honestly speaking, we still have problems and challenges when it comes to governance and the international community has committed itself to assisting the afghan government in capacity building so that the afghan government can provide basic services to the afghan people and step up the fight against corruption, etc. i had a talk with president karzai recently and he agreed that we must give top priority to that. and actually he has taken some
measures to fight corruption. >> rose: and he's leaving-- there's a new election in 2014. he will be departing, we assume. >> yeah. and it's for the afghans to elect their leadership. but let me add to this that we have actually seen progress in the development of afghanistan. the economic growth is around 7% to 8% annually from low level, but it's quite impressive. more people have access to electricity. we see flourishing markets. the educational system has improved. eight million children go to school. more than one-third are girls. 30% of teachers are female teachers. the health situation is better. more health centers have opened. child mortality has decreased. life expectancy has increased in
particular for women. so we have seen a lot of progress in afghanistan. >> rose: do you believe that there will be some success in closing down the sort of porousness of the afghan/pakistan border so the taliban forces, which have had a kind of safe haven can be closed? >> the border region is really a problem. and wherever we engage with the pakistani government or pakistani military we encourage them to step up the fight against terrorists and extremists in the border region. it remains an unsolved problem. i have to say that. and this is a reason why-- while our relationship with pakistan is sometimes a bit problematic the bottom line is that we need a strong partnership with pakistan if we are to solve these border problems.
>> rose: what are the opportunities or the challenges for nato in syria? >> i do believe that the right way forward in syria is a political solution syria is a very complex society. >> rose: and different from libya. >> absolutely. further more, when we took responsibility for the operation in libya, we did so on the basis of a clear united nations mandate and with clear and active support from countries in the region. and none of these conditions are fulfilled when it comes to syria. >> rose: so they will be unlikely to be any kind of intervention on the part of nato or nato countries? >> yeah, we have no intention to intervene militarily. of course we stand ready to protect and defend turkey as an ally should it be needed. but i do believe the right way forward in syria is a political
solution. in that respect it is strongly regretble that the u.n. security council has failed so far to agree on a legally binding resolution on syria. >> rose: do you have suggestions for them as to how they can get china and russia on board? >> some months ago an international so-called action group had a meeting in geneva. >> rose: right. >> that group also included russia. >> rose: right. >> from that meeting, a communique was issued that clearly stated that a transition process should be initiated in syria. towards democracy. >> rose: without condition? in other words, nothing has to happen because, as you know, the rebels are demanding assad has to leave. >> yeah. >> rose: and they're not willing apparently, to have much political conversations until that happens. >> yeah, but my point is that for the first time an
international gathering agreed on a process, an international meeting including russia agreed on a process leading to a transition in syria. my point is that could serve as the basis for an international response through the u.n. security council. you asked me what could i recommend. >> rose: right, right. >> that's what i could recommend. and, of course, if the parties involved did not comply with that binding resolution, it should have some consequences. it's not for me to elaborate on which consequences. but i do believe that the whole international community has a responsibility to prevent what i see as a humanitarian disaster in syria. and it is clearly a violation of international law.
but i think seen from a strategic point of view both russia and china should have a self-interest in being so to speak on the right side of history. and i think that could be an argument for them in favor of delivering a clear and unified and strong message from the international community. >> rose: do you think it's a stalemate today? >> more or less it is a stalemate. with severe consequences for the people of syria. and i think the international community has a responsibility to deliver a very clear message to the assad regime that they must stop violence and initiate a process towards democracy in syria. no regime can in the long-term
neglect the will of the people. >> rose: when you look at the balkans, we had an intervention without a u.n. resolution. nato acted without a u.n. resolution. can you imagine that happening in syria? >> testimony brief answer is no, but let me stress that nato acted on the basic of the principles of the u.n. charter when we took responsibility for the operation in kosovo. the operation aimed at preventing what we considered a genocide. but i have to say we conducted a very successful operation in libya because we had a clear united nations mandate and i can't imagine an operation
without a clear and explicit legal basis, but let me add to that that we have no intention to intervene militarily in syria. we have no discussions within nato on military options. >> rose: even a no-fly zone? >> no. because we do believe that the right way forward is a political solution. >> rose: do you miss politics? >> (laughs) i am in politics. >> rose: yes, of course. (laughs) but in a different way. i mean, you remember prime minister for, what what, eight years? how many years? >> yes. >> rose: eight years. do you miss that? the direct contact with people and the sort of give-and-take of politics? it's a different kind of politics. >> i liked to be prime minister of denmark. i liked the direct interaction with people. but i also find my current job very challenging and very interesting. i like international politics.
so i didn't leave denmark because i was tired of being a prime minister. >> rose: (laughs) but this challenge was there. >> exactly. >> rose: thank you for coming. it's a pleasure to have you on the program. >> you're welcome. thank you. >> rose: back in a moment. stay with us. >> rose: the barkley center in brooklyn has been a dream of developer bruce ratner for the last decade. its much anticipated opening marks the latest step in the revitalization of brooklyn. there have been protests for from people who worry about what development does to neighborhoods. it will be home to the nets basketball team. they are brooklyn's first major sports franchise since the dodgers departed in 1957. the nets kick off the season on november 1 against the cross-town rival the new york nicks. joining me now is mikhail prokhorov, the principal owner of the brooklyn nets. bruce ratner is the majority owner of barkley center and minority of the nets. irina prokhorova is editor and
chief of the new literary observer magazine. karen brooks hopkins is the president of the brooklyn academy of music known as bam. the prokhorov fund and bam have announced a new partnership to promote a cultural exchange between russia and the united states. i am pleased to have each of them at this table. you have been dreaming and dreaming and dreaming and dreaming. >> now it's finally here. sometimes i pinch myself, am i really here? it's been hard and long but worth it. >> rose: what was hard? >> what was hard i think was there was every single impediment from a recession to 35 litigations to the difficulty of constructing in the city. every aspect was difficult, really. getting a project done like that requires approvals and people litigate. and also-- you know, called different names and so on. >> rose: you were called lots of names if i remember. >> that's right. >> rose: because people didn't know your intent and they were worried what you were promising you wouldn't deliver. >> they didn't know what it
would look like. they were worried it wouldn't be attractive. they were worried that we wouldn't do it, that we'd be left with a hole in the ground. >> rose: so what's the level of the neighborhood protest now? community activists who still worry that a-- this kind of size will disrupt... >> rose: the actual opposition i would say is-- strong opposition is relatively small. i think there were 20 protesters out one day but generally quite small. but there's appropriate concerns as there should be. any time you're building a public facility you want to make sure it's safe and traffic is good. >> rose: did you have to be russian tough to get this made? >> russian tough? (laughter) >> rose: ask him. (laughs) >> i say my father was from russia so i got a little bit of it. but i when i met this guy i knew i was there. >> rose: okay. when you met this guy-- if you had not met this guy and had him take over some portion of the burden and opportunity of what are now the brooklyn nets, could
you have finished the project? >> no. the answer is no. without mikhail coming in and buying 80% of the team, providing the economics to do that i don't think we could have done that. >> rose: and a minority ownership-- >> a minority owner of the arena. he owns 45% of the arena. he wound up providing the economics to allow us to go ahead. it's critical. >> rose: was this something that was brought to you or were you troll, were you looking for this kind of opportunity in america? >> before i was the owner of the best european team in basketball and i smelled slowly, slowly, to find something-- i want to be the envy of all, frankly speaking. >> rose: yeah. >> and i do remember our meeting with bruce in my house and he was very soft spoken guy. so kind of timid guy. (laughter) a little. i know how tenacious he is. now we all know. (laughter) >> rose: did he turn out to be a tough negotiator?
>> i think sometimes you know it's in the air. and we became partners from the first meeting. and bruce is my best partner. >> we just knew. we got along. >> rose: so you came back and said it worked? >> it worked. we just knew, am i right mikhail? we just got along, it was a lovely evening and we knew it was in the air and the negotiations were easy. it was not hard. >> rose: how are you involved other than the fact that you are involved with the foundation, run the foundation and have a prominent role in the cultural life of the country? >> you know, just when the project of the arena just appeared and through-- you know it was a kind of challenge for me. i realized that the famous bam-- brooklyn academy of music sds a neighbor to the future of the arena and that was a great
chance to unite sports and culture and i'm kuwait sure that sports is-- this is a very important part of culture and now quite a lot of people say that sports-- it's really new art. in a way i quite agree. so that's-- it was a great-- arena with bam and to create this cultural neighborhood and as i understand that was a great idea of the bam for a long time, to create this cultural center. so i'm happy to help a little bit. >> rose: what does it mean for bam? >> well, the partnership is remarkable because obviously we're a very large international presenter. we have a lot of depth in terms of the russian work that we've presented but this three-year exchange where we can bring russian artists to bam and where we can send american artists back. and we're not only sending them to moscow, we're going to siberia. and i think that the
brooklyn/siberia connection is very interesting. i don't think anyone's done a cultural exchange with siberia before. so that's kind of really bamish. >> rose: as far as they could tell. >> exactly. so it's a very exciting thing for us to be able to do it. and also what's exciting for us is the proximity to the arena. we've been talking and now in the bam cultural district you have venues wan five-block radius between 200 seats to 19,000 seats at the arena. and we can't think of any place on the planet that has that kind of-- a number of venues and size of arts and entertainment options so it's an exciting opportunity for us to do things together. >> rose: before i talk more about this, tell me about the relationship between the two of you. you're older. >> yes. brother and sister. >> rose: brother and sister. i know that. i know that. but you live in the same house.
still live in the same house in moscow, >>. >> we live together. >> rose: we're very close. but when your parents died-- you were the older sister and took care of him and made him-- >> i don't know who took care of who. now days probably i consider him the elder brother in a way. >> it's not true. >> rose: what's not true? that you're the elder brother or--. >> you know, we have a very balanced family. >> rose: yes. >> i am in charge of income and my sister is in charge of. >> rose:-- everything else. (laughs) >> and in our family because of me we're a little bit above average in income and as far as intellectual level we're above that because of my sister. >> rose: just for a moment-- because an american audience, and this is a worldwide audience now-- how did you acquire the
opportunity to run the nick kel company? >> so it was nch the mid-'90s, it was a disaster in the economy of russia. >> rose: you were a financial expert. >> and you know like it was the station where, like different companies in the cities they were on the verge of dying. >> rose: right. >> and we were young, ambitious, risky and we were not afraid of nothing. so we bought a very bad enterprise. >> rose: you made a big bet? >> yes, because at the time we did our best in order to find partners abroad. nobody came because it was too risky. we spent a lot of money, we spent a lot of hours, two and three hours a day, now we can
show that this, for example, entity are one of the most profitable entities in the field production of nickel and platinum and palladium. but it was risky at the time because we have debt, more than one year to know the company. can't imagine this. and in the far north people they have no opportunity to receive salary for more than a half year. it was like really a disaster. it was a great disaster. and really we're very proud. >> rose: with so much at stake it all together was not necessarily safe, either. >> it wasn't safe at all. (laughter) >> rose: you were going say-- were you going add to that? because you remember. >> yes, i do remember because when mikhail became the general director of norilsk nickel he decided to launch a foundation because living in moscow in spite of all the difficulties in
the '90s, we couldn't imagine so we came and see how people lived how they survived. so that was the utmost importance, to create a foundation that could support culture, not in this narrow why but just to create the milieu for people to leave. you know, in this situation, look at the tragic history of rush sharr in the 20th century people managed to survive mostly due to their-- i should say-- to culture. because it is probably the stem of russian identity. it's not just pleasant-- to spend a pleasant evening in the theater because clinging to culture you manage to preserve dignity. so that's be why it's such an important issue. >> rose: from ballet to great novels to--
>> everything. contemporary art, every delight. anything. so in this way supporting culture we invest in future. >> rose: to determine go to the hermitage is an extraordinary experience. you're going promote cultural exchanges and then we'll come back to barkley center. >> well, the idea is that we will try to do around three events per year each way. >> rose: so play here, play there, play here. >> yeah. so we're in the process of figuring out what we're doing. so we're announcing the partnership. we know that we will have a philadelphia-based dance company that will be going to the regions in april to a dance festival there and we're also working on cinema and literature programs. so we're trying to figure out sending things back and forth. some things will be small, some things will be large. but the idea is that it will be multicultural and that it will be multifaceted.
>> rose: and mostly the performing arts or everything? >> well, we will do some visual arts as well. we're hoping to have a very visual artist come and create a piece of public art in the bam district. so that will make it very-- cut across all the various... >> rose: i want to talk about the barkley center and talk about what this means for brooklyn. this is the headline of new york magazine. "brooklyn is finished or has it only just begun?" we'll come to that question in a moment. the barkley center, it is what-- it's the center of the revitalized brooklyn, yes? >> it is. it's-- it really-- first of all, where it's located. it's right kind of in the downtown-- above 11 subway lines so it's the center in every kind of way. and as such it's a place where everybody can go to. it's got every type of entertainment. so i think it's going to be a major, major shift in the way people in brooklyn spend their extra time. >> rose: did you know early on that you had to get a sports
franchise to make this whole atlantic project work? >> well, it actually was the reverse. what happened was despite... >> rose: you needed an atlantic project to make the nets work? (laughter) >> you said it perfectly, that's true. marty mark wits, bless us all... >> rose: this is the borough president? >> borough president of brooklyn. get a sports team, gate sports team. the idea was to get a sports team. now where do we put them where all the subways were, atlantic terminal. so that's how it came about. >> rose: so you thought the reverse? >> it started with the team. >> rose: so he said-- like many people in brooklyn, they haven't forgotten the dodgers leaving. >> that's correct, they haven't forgotten. >> rose: you've learned that story. >> and the nice thing is that basketball is what baseball was many years ago. >> rose: indeed. >> basketball is really a brooklyn sport. >> rose: and a truly international sport. look at the olympics. >> correct.
>> rose: so you went in search of the nets. >> correct, yes. >> rose: was this an easy deal? >> no, it was a very hard deal because taking them out of new jersey wasn't easy. and we had to get a group of investors then we had three other bidders for the team. we won the bid and then we had to find... >> rose: you won the bid because you offered the most or-- >> that's the usual way, yes. (laughter) >> rose: but it matched perfectly with your eyes and with your desire. and you then promised that you would have an n.b.a. champion in three years. >> there's only one place first. only three years left. >> rose: you've got one great general manager. billy king is very good. you know where he went to college, of course. >> rose: >> duke? >> rose: yes. (laughs) >> i know. and we have a great coach. >> yes, absolutely. >> rose: so you're convinced you can do this.
or are you just sort of excited about it? >> i will punish myself of getting married if not. (laughter) >> rose: but you'll get married if you don't do it? you heard that here. >> the gauntlet has been thrown. >> rose: do you have anybody in mind? >> that's my wishful. i need nephews. that's my slogan. (laughter) >> rose: this is not what i thought this program would turn out to be. (laughter) the dating life of mikhail prokhorov. let me talk about-- how do you-- coming from afar, both of you see this idea of rise of brooklyn. i mean, this place, because he has said it's a microcosm of the united states. >> you know, i know a lot about brooklyn because i think that brooklyn, it's part of the american immigration. >> rose: yes. >> and russians are the second
diaspora in brooklyn and i feel some support for russian-speaking people. >> rose: yes. >> and for me brooklyn is like moscow. multinational, very active, gutsy. so i feel like home. and i really was surprised when i was appeared as the first foreign owner on the n.b.a. team that people were very friendly, very open minded, they stopped me on the street saying hello, let's go nets, etc., etc. so i feel surprised. >> rose: have you found good russian food in brooklyn? >> yeah, sure. >> rose: (laughs) the center itself, you have promised, both of you have, that this is going to be the best basketball arena in the world. >> it is. >> yes, it is. it already is. >> rose: what makes it the best basketball arena in the world. >> well, we start with what i said: transportation, architecture, the way the seating is done. it's all intimate.
great sight lines. it's beautiful inside. food. every aspect was done with a fan in mind. we trained our employees with disney so whether you get there by subway, going to be greeted with a smile, eat great and watch him win the championship. (laughter) rhett rhett an interveer view of barkley center for a game. you can play basketball there can't you. >> you sure can. >> rose: best arena you've ever mean? >> i think we can discuss a lot, it's better to see and i think we invite you on november 1 for the game between the nets and nicks and... >> rose: oh, my goodness! look at this. oh, my god! look at this. there's something romantic about brooklyn, too. there is a romance about brooklyn. >> there sure is. >> rose: oh, my god, i didn't realize-- >> especially for you. >> rose: to put my mouse on.
thank you very much. what are the colors of the brooklyn nets? >> black and white. >> rose: i assumed that. it's true, huh? >> it says a lot about brooklyn, black and white. that's the way it is, brooklyn attitude. black and white. >> it was designed by jay-z. jay-z did the logo. >> rose: tell us about the involvement of jay-z. >> it's been great from the beginning. i met jay-z the same way i met mikhail we saw each other, we met each other and got along and i put my hand, he put out his hand and we had a deal. >> rose: he's a minority partner. small minority partner. >> and he's been terrific. everything from basketball in terms of helping get players to designing logos to marketing to business sense and so on. he's got everything, really. >> rose: what could go wrong here, bruce? >> i hope nothing. >> rose: what worries you?
you're a worrier by definition. >> i am a worrier. >> rose: a soft spoken worrier. >> i have to think about that. i'm worried about traffic a little bit even though everybody had better take public transportation. so for those few who don't i'm worried about them. there's always issues of safety and so on at any arena so you want to do it perfectly and everyone's looking at us. there's a tremendous amount of attention so you want to make sure it's safe, you want to make sure everything works perfectly. it's really-- all the attention we've gotten means that anything that doesn't go right is going to be magnified. >> rose: is it to make sure-- i would assume-- that none of this causes brook tlin lose brooklyn. to be what it is. i mean, if you have the definition of something that has soul you want to make sure nothing gets in the way of that soul. and throughout all of this that was very critical. whether it be the food or
everything. how do we continue the soul of brooklyn? it's not easy to define the soul. >> rose: so it doesn't look like brooklyn has been bought. >> that is correct. >> rose: you're smiling. do you think i'm right or wrong? >> i think barkley center is in keeping with the spirit of brooklyn. >> rose: in what way? >> it's very energetic. it's fashion. and if you look at the history there were a lot of claims to to change urban landscapes. just the eiffel tower. we do remember that they were against the eiffel tower but now we can't imagine paris without it and it's a matter of getting used to it. >> rose: you can't imagine new york without central park or you can't imagine places that-- or the empire state building or the guggenheim or those things that are landmarks. brooklyn bridge. >> i would say that brooklyn today sort of represents the urban energy of 21st century new
york city. our audience is very young. they're very diverse. they're ready to be challenged. they're adventurous. and i think that that's sort of the vibe and the whole attitude of brooklyn. so the sports, the culture, everything that's happening sort of fits together right now. it's the brooklyn moment. >> rose: and people when they think new york, you want them to think brooklyn? >> yeah. and i think that people are thinking brooklyn. because of all of this energy that we just talked about. because there is this sort of edge and attitude that is brooklyn. and i think bam has been a large part of sdwrooifing that revitally sags. >> rose: everybody that knows brooklyn knows bam and when you think about brooklyn you think about bam because it's always been a cull cultural center for thinking about what's going on. >> well, it's interesting to
hear them talk about the fact that there was a disaster in the region and they had to really try to move forward to enhance the economy and culture of the regions. bruce and i kind of felt like that about brooklyn. bruce was our chairman for ten years. so we have a lot in common here that is just even beyond this partnership. we've both sort of fought our way back to be somethinging in a city where it's not easy to be something. >> rose: what's the biggest misconception about you that you would like for people to know is simply not-- >> that's a very good question. i think that this idea that the intent was to do something great for brooklyn, it was. it was not-- you know, economic, it was not all-- it was really trying to do something great for brooklyn. i love brooklyn. i've been working in brooklyn for 25 years, chairman of bam for ten years. i like every aspect of brooklyn. so that was the idea. on the other hand it's been described that i had these other motives. that's i think... >> rose: you had to do all kinds
of things to get there. a lot of roadblocks and you had to manipulate politicians. >> that's the other thing. we did hit in the traditional by that which large projects are done. >> rose: here's what's interesting. is the story that i read that you had to go to cleave land to the family? >> that is true, yes. >> rose: tell me. >> so i'm part of a larger family and public company. >> rose: you've done well in real estate. >> i've done well in real estate. they have and i have. there's a board so i have to go back for board meetings and about half the board is family so i would have to go back and report all the stuff that was going on, how we were getting sued and so on and occasionally it was very difficult. >> rose: and the family might be saying to you-- >> what are you doing? what are you doing? are you kidding? and, of course, they're not from new york, that's the other thing so when you see the kind of litigations and so on, the noise it was not easy. >> rose: you've always-- at least in my public perception-- have been a liberal politically.
>> yes, i am. >> rose: and some people say let me see if this is true, he's liberal politically and he is-- he's in real estate development? >> well, from the day that i started real estate development i said i would only do real estate development if it had a civic purpose or employment. and every project i've done i've attempted to do that. metro tech in downtown brooklyn, employment. so that's really-- i have to have some civic idea before i'll do development. >> rose: speaking of family, you're running for president. there's a debate coming up. you can't be there. she takes over. tell me about that. >> (laughs) what would you like me to tell you? >> rose: you won! you were very impressive. they started calling you on twitter the angela merkel of russia. laugh >> (laughs) >> rose: and he was very proud of you. were you not? >> i'm calling her a superstar.
just this side of superstar. >> rose: megastar. the debate was about? >> well, about cultural, as a matter of fact. >> rose: so they were playing on your turf. >> perhaps but my opponent is also cultural. he is a great artist and direct or and very talented actor. >> rose: your opponent. >> yes. and you know i think the public was so much involved in this conversation. i think-- because speaking of culture it's really speaking about the future of russia. new hampshire is future and past. >> yes. well, past is always-- you know, is the beginning of the future. i don't know how you can separate the things. the problem is when we speak about culture we speak about national identity. we're speaking about some values in a way. it's not speaking about simply supporting this and this.
but this is a concept of future and the project of future. so that was a harsh talk, a hard talk, how we see the future of russia and what we can do to change it for better. but speaking about our friendship with bam, i would say it's very important personally for me because a foundation sports russian regions and the problem is to deny the regions to the world. and in a way it's really-- brooklyn is a kind of-- a very special region. there's quite a lot of russian peopleiving here and we can live in different countries, different regimes but i would say culture is the best policy and that's really a common value which unites us. >> rose: a russian future. do you want to be president?
$thank you for question. now i'm on the stage of making a new party from scratch. that's very important to russia because i want all bright western minded people and to create really strong political power in russia. because now we have two russia living in my country. 25% it's western-minded people, very incompetentive and very self-made. 25 just in between, and 50% old-fashioned russia. and i low pressure do my best to create a very powerful political party in order to persuade all russians to be more western, to be more close to the vest. >> rose: in terms of western values, freedom of expression and human rights and
appreciation-- >> i do believe in power of market, free competition, human rights, democracy. and for the time being unfortunately it's only minority. but i'm ready to work very hard, to make values to be domination in the nearest future. >> rose: are you secure enough not to be worried about being an opponent of vladimir putin? >> just what is the problem with relationship between like kremlin and opposition? for the time being our opposition unfortunately plays the same values as kremlin values but just the opposite. so my concept is to have very profound, straightforward dialogue with if government, with people, with every person. it's very important. >> rose: does president putin
welcome that dialogue? >> i have no problem to speak. no problem. but if you want to speak, if you want to have a positive opinion you cannot rest this opinion to the public, to putin, to all other people. it depends what is your feeling from inside. i came to politics from business and i feel that it's not about making money. the main goal for business is to change mentality. so change community, to change life. and if you want to change you need to fight for your values and having a very strong team. we know how to change it. because when i was a chief executive we changed drastically the mentality of people there. >> rose: mr. court kov ski, will he die in prison? >> i hope not. i think it's a very active
question of russians and i wish he will be free as soon as possible. >> rose: do you believe he was framed? >> i think it was a political decision and it was a fight between conservative part of russian elite and liberal part and this fight in russian elite is very tough to influence president putin because like in your country, like in my country there are people who are still stuck in cold war mind-set. and i'll do my best and this project together with-- it's very important to use non-political opportunity to make this opportunity for our peoples to meet face to face in culture and sport and business and for me it's really sad to see the level of mistrust
growing between united states and russia. >> rose: really. >> mistrust is growing? >> growing. >> rose: what's the issue in your judgment? >> i think we have a lack of relations in culture, in business. because i can't imagine that between the united states and russia is less than to know what between the united states and thailand. can't imagine this. >> rose: no. >> so that's why we need to use any opportunity to establish stronger ties between two countries. and i believe that we have a great and exciting time now in russia and i do believe we can put our country on another level because now we have a great discussion inside of the russian elite. what is human rights, what is values for the future because really we're a very young country.
we have more than-- we have a little bit more than 20 years of democracy and we made a great transformation from socialism to capitalism from soviet society to more open society so woe need more time. >> rose: it's very interesting to watch if you do what i do sitting at a table and talking to people like you it's a fascinating process. what is more interesting is if the united states and russia and china and some other important places are on the same page the opportunity to solve the great problems and issues of our time is much easier to do so therefore the demand becomes more imperative, i think. i want to say for those of us who live in new york those of us who consider and believe new york is not one borough, manhattan, but five boroughs and
there is brooklyn and brooklyn has had a romance about it for a long, long, long time. just think about the brooklyn bridge and drive down the f.d.r. and look at the brooklyn bridge and think what happens when you cross over that bridge and a new world that you find you will see that it is a place that has a firm foundation to build something new and that is what's taking place today, all of you are a part of that